Post details: Moon-Bat-Alarmist Warning!


Permalink 07:00:00 am, by Email , 1946 words   English (CA)
Categories: General Shtuff

Moon-Bat-Alarmist Warning!


Awright... I've been DRAGGED into a "political" situation... not happy about it, but I need to address it.

When I was a kid, we spent at least three weeks (usually much more) at a family cottage... it was on a small islands on a small lake in "cottage country"... it faced the lake and had a river circle around it's back... and it was all ours.

Up until my "tweens", one of the favourite things to do was catch frogs and baby turtles... which were in great supply. In fact, turtles were so bountiful that my mother named the islands "Turtle Islands".

Then a plant opened in the Untied States... and another in Ontario... all within a year of each other. Both these plants were literally thousands of miles away from "Turtle Islands"... and we were warned, the pollution from these "necessary" plants would cause much acid rain and issues... and initially we scoffed... and scoffed loudly. These plants were FAR, FAR away... and this was all fear-mongering by those who simply wanted to shut down something in their own back yard or stop industry.

...then, the next year, there were no baby frogs in the lake... then no turtles... then minnows (baby fish) disappeared... and I realised at a VERY young age, there's something TO this "acid rain" stuff!

I also had a fondness of cemeteries... growing up near one of the largest and most historic cemeteries in Toronto, I loved going through and literally walking in history... and I saw it there too. Limestone markers that could be read three years ago, now looked like pumice stone which could be literally shredded with a fingernail. That which was SUPPOSE to last forever had turned to calcium stone and was literally disintegrating before my eyes.

In school, we did experiments on PH balances of the rain... and depending on where the wind was coming from, it was genuinely frightening.

Luckily (for "them"), before I turned eighteen, they enacted tough laws to control this problem... and industry and some government agencies FREAKED!

This will bankrupt our businesses!
This will kill employment!
This will cost every tax payer their home!!!

Guess what?

It didn't.

...and the last time I was up North, there were baby frogs... and minnows... and turtles on "Turtle Islands".

Today, we have a new "threat"... GLOBAL WARMING!

Now, it's true... scientists INITIALLY argued whether these weird things called greenhouse gasses were making us "colder" or "warmer"... then they agreed... we were warming up... and yes, there IS evidence of this.

Of course, there's evidence that this has happened before... but it's a given, we're moving faster now.

Thanks to a current political regime of people built on "big oil" (and this isn't "MOON BATTING", it's true... the Bush family are oil men... and even our own Prime Minister Harper has most of his support in Alberta... an oil-rich province...) and our economies are very much built on the auto sector still... These "environmental issues" were acknowledged, but never really taken all that seriously... "Just another environmentalist concern" is how it was played...

Heck, when it was FIRST being bandied about, Canada's political climate was Liberal with a capital "L"... and we still more-or-less went, "Oh yeah, it's important... moving on to the next topic..."

In my opinion, the NAIL in the coffin with many is the man who really came out with the popularization of the "Worst Case Scenario"... former vice-president Al Gore.

Now, since Al Gore is a Democrat, it now became a party-line issue in the states... because, as many good Republicans will tell you, if a Democrat likes it, it MUST be bad!

Don't get me wrong here, I know in my heart that had Bob Dole, a Republican, been the champion of this cause, Democrats would be saying it was all bunk and a right-wing conspiracy to drive up oil prices.

...moving on...

Then, all of a "sudden", just like when we were wondering if cigarettes were bad for you, think-tanks and consulting firms appeared with "scientific data that was absolute" saying it was all bunk. The Earth WASN'T warming... except it is... and when they got caught, they changed their tune... "The Earth isn't warming MUCH!"... and they got caught again, so they changed their tune again... "Okay, the Earth is warming a bit... but it's cyclical history, not pollution!"

Which is it?

The latter is the current "argument".

All I can think of is how tobacco is good for me because the concept that it caused cancer and heart disease is a Republican conspiracy to kill tobacco farmers in Democrat states... and acid rain didn't kill frogs and turtles or dissolve limestone... and the Earth is flat and the Sun rotates around us.

Now, before you get a poison pen comment ready, I will argue AGAINST the "Worst Case Scenario" people... I sincerely doubt that in fifty years, the world will cease to exist. I sincerely doubt that Manhattan will flood out of existence and that Las Vegas will turn into Ocean Front Property.

....but I look at WHAT we're "supposed to do" as dictated by the so-called doom-sayers...

Clean the air.

How awful!

...and haven't I heard this before?

As someone with children, I can honestly say, WHAT'S THE HARM?

Realistically, we managed to do a decent (if not-all-that perfect) job with much of our acid rain problems... and we didn't have rampant job loss and the "quality of life" didn't suddenly dive over a cliff...

Shouldn't we TRY?

Here are the arguments I've had to NOT clean up our act...

Space! The Final Frontier!

#1: What's the point? India and China won't clean up and they'll steam-roller our economy because, without pollution restrictions, they will be able to produce things more cheaply!

Okay, setting aside the worry of a "Global Political Body" which frightens too many, who would they sell the goods to? An economy, in order to thrive, needs trade... and if there WERE restrictions on these things, do you really believe that their goods would be allowed in North America and Europe... and in order for complete industrialization, China and India need to be able to buy equipment and materials as well as sell products to America and Europe.

On top of that, it IS cheaper to make a gas-guzzling monstrosity of a car... and yet, no one is... why do you believe that to be true? Price of gas? Perhaps... or perhaps it's because you NEED to pass an emissions test in North America in order to own/sell it? Isn't the North American auto-sector's worst enemy Japanese and Korean cars? They're more fuel efficient and have less emission problems than American cars... They are greener. Using this model, it's a given that China and India, once fully industrialized, would either have to toe the line... or suffer environmentally and economically for their pollution.

...and also, shouldn't "we" lead by example? Finger pointing while the ship is sinking or has sunk won't bring it back to the surface... or prevent disaster.

Space! The Final Frontier!

#2: What's the point? It's ALL natural! We can't stop it!

No, but we are adding to it... even if it's only by 1%, that's 1% more crud my kid breaths in. That's 1% more time before things get bad... and on the scale the "nay-sayers" are giving us, that 1% could be literally hundreds if not thousands of years.

Space! The Final Frontier!

#3: My way of life will be horribly altered!

I'm old enough to have heard this about SO many things... and yet, the same people who railed against computers, transistors, plastic bags, blue-box recycling, and even "Tipper-Stickers" on CDs and those hurt by the banning of smoking in the workplace manage to survive and thrive... even the plants that became "acid rain" compliant are still going...

What happened to the economic disasters of banning PCPs and lead paint? Those were suppose to put certain industries into a tail-spin... they didn't... and there's far fewer birth defects in North America.

Space! The Final Frontier!


I just don't get it.

Canada's conservative Prime Minister Stephen Harper really slapped it down... I must paraphrase, but it's true... "This is an important issue and something we must address, but how? Do you want me to ban all cars from the road? If Canada wants me to do that, I will!" which I see as him saying "We do need to do something... but we need to implement it properly with a minimum of issues."


You wanna say it's all bunk? Fine... why not STILL clean up to make the planet nicer for ourselves and our kids?

You wanna say it's a "political plot"? Why? What would be gained? Cleaning up the air? Getting "Research and Development" teams working on better and more environmentally friendly things? How awful!

I just don't get it... and those who rail and say, "I won't be a party to this clean-up!" baffle me...

Perhaps they don't have kids that liked to catch baby turtles?


One of the real problems too is again, we're dealing with extremists... One side is saying we MUST eliminate EVERYTHING YESTERDAY... and the other saying we DON'T NEED to eliminate ANYTHING EVER.

My gut tells me both are wrong.


We can't do "nothing"... nor should we try to do "everything".

I have to assume a balance could be met.

Using my acid rain example, cars WERE called the major source of pollutants that caused the problem... but they didn't ban cars... they went after those industries that were worst... and it helped.


I have also been very gently accused of only listening to a politician and a talk-show host. Actually, Dr. David Suzuki has been talking about this since the 1980's... and in the 1990's, he more-or-less predicted our doom... years before the talk-show host and the politician had lunch.


If you disagree with me... fine... but remember please, ARGUE THE FACTS, not the personalities.

When I tell you I toe NO party lines, I ain't kidding... to some of my friends, I am a "right-wing, gun-totin', neo-con, Nazi, facist" for some of my views... and to others, I'm a "left-wing, terrorist-hugging, tree-hugging, gun-taking, moon-bat"... I can't win... but I can represent my feelings and thoughts... and I try to back it up with common sense and information... I ask you do the same... and remember, I kid you not when I say "MY FRIENDS" call me those names... they are still friends. We just disagree on certain topics.


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Comment from: administration [Member] Email ·
Can someone please take the time to explain to this Canadian gal what a "Moon Bat" is supposed to be? I see it on American political blogs sometimes used like a school yard taunt. Is it the equivalent of grown adults calling other adults stinky poo-poo pants???? Seriously I have no idea what it means, but at the same token am not inclined to attempt to do any research on it??? Can someone give me the readers digest definition. Thanks.
PermalinkPermalink 02/05/07 @ 07:43
Comment from: admin [Member] Email ·
Hey Sue... Click here and read definition #1 and #3.
PermalinkPermalink 02/05/07 @ 16:50
Comment from: MsDemmie [Visitor] ·
What is wrong is that we are lazy - we dont like hard work, and we like to be comfortable.

We take the car or SUV instead of walking.

We would rather have cheap energy consuming lightbulbs rather than energy saving expensive ones.

We live in a society of instant , rather than working towards - we haev forgotten our roots - in short we rarely walk barefoot upon this earth.
PermalinkPermalink 02/05/07 @ 18:23
Comment from: admin [Member] Email ·
Hey MsDemmie... but what bugs me is how they try so hard to justify their inactivity.
PermalinkPermalink 02/05/07 @ 18:54
Comment from: MsDemmie [Visitor] ·
Maddening isnt it !
PermalinkPermalink 02/06/07 @ 09:45
Comment from: admin [Member] Email ·
Hey MsDemmie... Oh dear, look at these...
I love the last one... there's a group here called "NRSP" - Natural Resources Stewardship Project - or, as they called 'em... "Not Real Science People!" Guess who funds 'em? :)
PermalinkPermalink 02/07/07 @ 21:48
Comment from: Blandly Urbane [Visitor] ·

I get the impression that those that submit "definitions," at this site are slightly, um, er, biased? Very surprising indeed.

Not one I would describe as "moonbat-lite," although I'm not sure as that is not defined. That and I just made it up.

Then again, my opinion is one from a:

"Right wing,"

"Right wing basket case,"

"Right wing nut job,"

Sorry, my xhtml skills are pretty non-existent, so I'm not even sure if I could have done what Mattadmin (what a name) did with the link to the site.

(Edited by Admin: Fixed the links!)

Entertaining nonetheless....

We had our opportunity to get our acts together in the 70's and went right back to business as usual. But, I sure would appreciate it if this could actually be discussed/debated civilly/blandly/urbanely, as each extreme is just extreme.

The term "global warming," isn't the best either when you get right down to it. It's easy to confuse this with the natural course of things if one really feels the need to.
PermalinkPermalink 02/08/07 @ 13:21
Comment from: admin [Member] Email ·
Mattadmin = "Matthew The Admin"... Me!

Aw, I was only kidding... with the definitions. Granted, when the term "Moon-Bat" was tossed at me on a message board a while back, I don't think they meant I was a wee, winged mamal with a fondness for lunar activities.

Actually, considering the other words in their missives which weren't REALLY directed at "me", but at anyone who dared suggest looking into pollution might not be a bad idea, "Moon-Bat" wasn't the worst of them.

Sadly, as you stated, "extremists" make everyone look bad...

Ever since I did this post, I've had more "hate mail" and whatnot than ever before on ANYTHING I've ever done before... and as usual, with angry missives, the points and concepts are missed... and "name calling" as well as accusations of where my political allegiances lie take the fore.

I disagree that "Global Warming" is a misnomer... but I do agree that we're not losing Manhattan in the next couple of years. I disagree that it's all natural... but I agree that total measures are NOT the answer.

Granted, even Mr. Gore said he's presenting the "worst case scenario" and is trying to "shock" people into action.

Lastly, the "science" that I've seen and been presented with so far that "counters" global warming is skewed... and is funded improperly.

As a scientist myself, I want neutrality... and it IS possible... but not as long as alarmists in BOTH camps are spewing B.S. with their own agendas.

The REAL truth is that yes, the "mean temperature" of the world is climbing... it's done this before, but not so quickly. We HAVE polluted our planet... and there's a BETTER than average CHANCE this is contributing to the problem. Ergo: We must do something... and at worst, we're just going to clean up our own environment... PROVIDED that the "extremists" on either side don't dictate absolutes in changes.

...but I'll be honest... I find that those "on the right" have so politicised this issue that it's now a "hearts and minds" thing... and some, apparently many, are really passionate about their wish NOT to do anything about things and how those of us who DARE suggest otherwise are... well... "moon-bat" is the nicest word used, really.

Nah, "naive" was the tamest word used... "moon-bat" was second. Above these, the three most oft used words are not printable on a family oriented website.

I'm bad... apparently.

Well, trust me... Friday's the LAST gasp about this... and it's mostly about a history lesson one of the fine folks that disliked my missive tried to give me.
PermalinkPermalink 02/08/07 @ 16:15
Comment from: Blandly Urbane [Visitor] ·
I'm sorry....I'm confused???????

You hurled no epithets at me and I am now at a loss as to how to counter your arguments!!!!!!!

Get off the logic pal!!!!!!!!!
PermalinkPermalink 02/09/07 @ 13:11
Comment from: admin [Member] Email ·
Hey Blandly Urbane... Uh, sorry... um... You... You... um... er... Let me tell you... ah... um... er... Well, that's the type of... em... um... er...


You Blogger!

Shall we say pistols at dawn?
PermalinkPermalink 02/09/07 @ 13:27
Comment from: "Eileen" [Visitor] ·
It's all about money...
$ $ $ $ $ $$$ $$ $$$ $$ $ $ $ $
our money? Noooo....:)

The guys in the big banks, the guys running the countries. Basically the guys who already HAVE the money and the power who want MORE and MORE and MORE and just can't get enough of the stuff!

If ANYTHING doesn't = we gonna make more money in our greedy bloody soaked pockets.
Then we're gonna lie and cheat and whatch people literally die...because all we really care about is keeping and making more of our money.

...and I say this as one disabled person who has/had to fight (and had to fight but did win! on more than one occasion) with other disabled persons just to try and get the disability, proper medications (still trying to get one med.), doctors apointments, tests, surgeries, palliative care (people dying at home uncared for... witnessed it..when I was still working in healthcare).

If our Gov. doesn't care. (Yes they'll give you lip service and warm smiles and words)

...or are too busy to care for their current sick and injured people... why would they care about the healthy people who might get sick because of the enviroment?
FUTURE sick people...BAH!! I can hear them laughing :):)until their own relative get sick and then gets the best healthcare available.
Not that I'm bitter..... :):):)

They just ignore you and say ...
Oh well...
"Probably statistically it's all about normal anyway for kids getting asthma..if they hire the right statistition" (sad sarcastic grin)


PermalinkPermalink 03/29/07 @ 12:02
Comment from: administration [Member] Email ·
You've got that right Eileen, how fast would a cure for AIDS be had if one of the Bush twins was diagnosed with it.

However in this case we do not have to solely rely on the government, we can do our part, each and everyone of us. Lead by example, and put pressure on the powers that be.

PermalinkPermalink 03/30/07 @ 11:23



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